The discourses of Epictetus

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1. UniverseHackerMay 2024
   The Discourses of Epictetus - This is useful to re-read frequently while thinking about any new challenges in my life, as these are powerful tools for managing hardship and generally living well.

   When I say no, I feel guilty by Manuel J. Smith - a book on assertive and non-manipulative communication. This has been incredibly valuable for improving my personal relationships and work. It's also allowed me to recognize and defend myself against emotional manipulation, which is more common than I realized. For many people that is the main way they communicate- by trying to control others with guilt through manipulation.. and I used to be both unaware and extremely vulnerable to it. It is useful to re-read and practice frequently, as these are skills that require practice.

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2. rramadassDec 2021
   You are craving "External Validation and Recognition". Nothing wrong with it except that this is a "Desire" which if unchecked will make your Life miserable and unhappy. The Internet has made it worse by giving you a very very large sample size to compare to. Also remember that 90% of what you read on the Internet is fake/exaggerated and the remaining 10% is showing only their best face (and no failures). "Outliers" are always few and far between (it is still more or less a bell-shaped curve); If you want to become one, then be prepared to put in a lot of hard work.

   Read the "Discourses" of Epictetus for some perspective;

   In every act consider what precedes and what follows, and then proceed to the act. If you do not consider, you will at first begin with spirit, since you have not thought at all of the things which follow; but afterwards when some consequences have shown themselves, you will basely desist (from that which you have begun). “I wish to conquer at the Olympic games.” [And I too, by the gods: for it is a fine thing]. But consider here what precedes and what follows; and then, if it is for your good, undertake the thing. You must act according to rules, follow strict diet, abstain from delicacies, exercise yourself by compulsion at fixed times, in heat, in cold; drink no cold water, nor wine, when there is opportunity of drinking it. In a word you must surrender yourself to the trainer, as you do to a physician. Next in the contest, you must be covered with sand, sometimes dislocate a hand, sprain an ankle, swallow a quantity of dust, be scourged with the whip; and after undergoing all this, you must sometimes be conquered. After reckoning all these things, if you have still an inclination, go to the athletic practice. If you do not reckon them, observe you will behave like children who at one time play as wrestlers, then as gladiators, then blow a trumpet, then act a tragedy, when they have seen and admired such things. So you also do: you are at one time a wrestler (athlete), then a gladiator, then a philosopher, then a rhetorician; but with your whole soul you are nothing: like the ape you imitate all that you see; and always one thing after another pleases you, but that which becomes familiar displeases you. For you have never undertaken anything after consideration, nor after having explored the whole matter and put it to a strict examination; but you have undertaken it at hazard and with a cold desire.

   So have confidence/faith in yourself, use others as inspiration/motivation and only compare your "current" self to your "previous" self for improvement.

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3. retzkekJun 2021
   Note that both the collected Dialogues (letters) of Seneca and Discourses of Epictetus are available from Standard Ebooks for free. I can't speak to the quality of the translations, but as far as e-books go they are always fantastic productions (compared to just grabbing the text off Project Gutenberg).

   https://standardebooks.org/ebooks/seneca/dialogues/aubrey-st...

   https://standardebooks.org/ebooks/epictetus/discourses/georg...

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4. kashyapcApr 2020
   For those who wish to truly deep-dive, I strongly suggest to skip the "meta books" on Stoicism, and go straight to the original works. There's the Big Three—Seneca, Epictetus, and Marcus Aurelius. Be prepared to invest at least ten months (the longer, the better) of active study to get a decent grounding.

   From my experience of reading multiple translations of the Big Three, for someone new to Stoicism, I'd suggest not to start with the popular recommendation of Marcus Aurelius.

   Start with Seneca's Letters, then Epictetus (an ex-slave, and a profound influence on Marcus Aurelius), and only then Marcus Aurelius, the Roman Emperor. (To quote the foremost Stoic scholar, A.A. Long: "[...] That an ex-slave actually shaped a Roman Emperor's deepest thoughts is one of the most remarkable testimonies to the power and applicability of Epictetus' words.")

   The quality of the English translation matters a lot. Here are my recommendations:

   • Seneca: Letters on Ethics — translation by Margaret Graver and A. A. Long. This is the most recent translation, reads extremely well, outstanding notes, and wonderfully typeset. It's translated by the current foremost experts; can't get better than this. I've been reading this for four months. (If this is a tad pricey for you, I've also heard good things about Selected Letters; translated by Elaine Fantham.)

   • Epictetus: Encheiridion, and Selections from Discourses, by A.A. Long. This is a short book; the value addition here is the great introduction, and the outstanding glossary. (NB: there is no escaping full Discourses of Epictetus—refer below.)

   • Epictetus: Discourses, Fragments and Handbook — translation by Robin Hard, intro by Christopher Gill; Oxford University Press. Spend a good four months immersing yourself in it. Epictetus is full of heavy irony, dark humor, histrionic wit, and sarcasm. Absolutely my favourite.

   • Epictetus: A Stoic and Socratic Guide, by A.A. Long. Important Note: To get maximum value out of this, you must have already read at least one translation of Epictetus' full Discourses! This book orients the reader to Epictetus with an extremely valuable context: how not to misinterpret his unqualified faith in "divine providence" (which can grate on our "modern ears"); the influence of Plato and the "Socratic Elenchus" (colloquially known as "Socratic Method"); deep insights into Epictetus' own inimitable style; and a rich bibliography.

   • Marcus Aurelius: Meditations. There are at least six translations. I'd suggest to start with the gentler translation by Gregory Hays. If you like it, then you can research other translations. (A.S.L Farquharson spent a lifetime on his translation of the Meditations; it also has commentary. I sometimes consult this edition.)

   • The Inner Citadel: The Meditations of Marcus Aurelius, by Pierre Hadot. This needs to be read only after you've read at least one translation of Marcus Aurelius This is a fantastic dissection of Aurelius' work—Hadot studied him for 25 years. Besides fresh translations of the Meditations, it also contains unparalleled summary of Epictetus, and many quotes of Seneca.

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   I'll end with one of my favourite Epictetus quotes:

   "For sheep, too, don't vomit up their fodder to show the shepherds how much they've eaten, but digest their food inside them, and produce wool and milk on the outside. And so you likewise shouldn't show off your philosophical principles to ordinary people, but rather show them in the actions that result from those principles when they've been properly digested."

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5. beaconstudiosDec 2019
   Meditations can be a slog - he repeats himself constantly, as is the tendency in published ancient Greek diaries/correspondence. It's a great grounding for stoicism though. I'd recommend also reading the Enchiridion and Discourses of Epictetus - I found them easier to absorb.
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6. strasse86Sep 2018
   Discourses of Epictetus
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