The march of folly
Traces and explores the recurring pursuit by governments of policies contrary to their own interests.
Stats for nerds
4recommend
7mentions
7people
2015–2026years
57% recommend43% neutral
Mentions per year
What Hacker News says
- > was it always this stupid?
Excellent question. There are two easily readable sources I know of covering historical events of the sort you're asking about. The first is Barbara W. Tuchman's The March of Folly: From Troy to Vietnam, where the entire premise is that stupid people did stupid things and then doubled down on stupidity as they went along. The second is Eichmann in Jerusalem: A Report on the Banality of Evil, in which Hannah Arendt details just how dull and unimaginative Eichmann was. She writes, "it was difficult indeed not to suspect that he was a clown", and suggests that Eichmann was not especially different from anyone he worked for, right up to the top.
History doesn't seem clownish because of the way it is recorded and taught. Even Arendt's writing is cool and formal compared to the histrionics we see on social media and many news outlets.
> Was there a Napeolonic era equivalent to a media figure known for making light of school shootings, getting killed in a school shooting, a second after again making light of school shootings?
The assassination of Archduke Franz Ferdinand, and subsequent events leading to the start of the First World War, were filled with errors and stupidity, so much that history mostly lumps them all under the term "July Crisis", and rarely goes into detail. If you're familiar with the Abilene paradox, you have a framework for how the Great War started as the result of collective actions by soldiers, diplomats, and national leaders.
- I loved "Apocalypse Now" as a statement of the idiocy of politics and war, which forces humans to shed the thin layer of culture and humanity.
Sone interesting tidbits I learned after watching the movie (many years ago):
The movie's is based on Conrad's book "Heart of Darkness" (nothing new), which was regarded as a critique of the Belgian exploitation of (and atrocities in) the Congo region at the end of the 19th century, cf. these Wikipedia articles https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atrocities_in_the_Congo_Free_S... and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heart_of_Darkness
And, btw, the last chapter of Barbara Tuchman's excellent book "The March of Folly: From Troy to Vietnam" contains an interesting reminiscense of how and why the US intervened in Vietnam.
- A teacher of mine once told us that "The road to hell is paved with good intentions." I think that's one of the paradoxes of life and we see this over and over again where a lot of good people try to do the right thing but the collective effects of their efforts end up being net negative. Rather than conspiracies, I think this paradox can explain some of the challenges we face today. Barbara Tuchman wrote a great book called "The March of Folly" that basically documents some famous cases of people unwittingly working against their own best interest, even if the individual steps themselves might have made sense.
- If you haven't read it already, Tuchman's The March of Folly continues the same theme, but as the consequences of the limits of humans and our institutions played out in a few other historical settings. Not as good as Guns of August, but still worth reading
- In the movie Thirteen Days, JFK mentions a book titled March of Folly by Barbara Tuchmann. I bought the book on that tip and it has an interesting chapter on Vietnam. I don't think adding a chapter on this "special operation" would even be worth it as it would just be repetitive.
- See also: Stupidity: My Reading List for a 12-Week Course (and a Final Exam) By Ted Gioia https://www.honest-broker.com/p/stupidity-a-reading-list
Here’s Tuchman from “The March of Folly:”
Misgovernment is of four kinds, often in combination. They are: 1) tyranny or oppression, of which history provides so many well known examples that they do not need citing; 2) excessive ambition, such as Athens' attempted conquest of Sicily in the Peloponnesian War, Philip II's of England via the Armada, Germany's twice-attempted rule of Europe by a self-conceived master race, Japan's bid for an empire of Asia; 3) incompetence or decadence, as in the case of the late Roman empire, the last Romanovs and the last imperial dynasty of China; and finally 4) folly or perversity. This book is concerned with the last in a specific manifestation; that is, the pursuit of policy contrary to the self-interest of the constituency or state involved. Self-interest is whatever conduces to the welfare or advantage of the body being governed; folly is a policy that in these terms is counter-productive.
