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    KeenLab Blog

    keenlab.tencent.com · Company blog · on HN since 2016

    Tencent's Keen Security Lab publishes vulnerability research on cars, virtual machines, and iOS, including its Tesla Autopilot work.

    Visit blogHN submissions
    SecurityHardware & ElectronicsMobile & Apple
    What HN says

    HN links it for the Tesla Autopilot security research, and commenters use it to question self-driving safety and to find the original paper.

    Stats for nerds
    22HN people shared it
    16linked in comments
    228story points
    May 2024last shared
    2017people per year2024

    Top posts on HN

    1. 1
      Exploiting Wi-Fi Stack on Tesla Model S
      1 person · 196 points · first shared 2020 · 68 comments on HN
    2. 2
      What happens if an attacker can get code execution on Tesla's autopilot [pdf]
      5 people · 10 points · first shared 2019 · 1 comments on HN
    3. 3
      Car Hacking Research: Remote Attack Tesla Motors
      3 people · 8 points · first shared 2016 · 1 comments on HN
    4. 4
      Experimental Security Assessment of BMW Cars: A Summary Report [pdf]
      3 people · 5 points · first shared 2018 · Discussion on HN
    5. 5
      New Car Hacking Research: 2017, Remote Attack Tesla Motors Again
      1 person · 3 points · first shared 2017 · 1 comments on HN
    6. 6
      Tencent Keen Security Lab: Experimental Security Research of Tesla Autopilot
      4 people · 2 points · first shared 2019 · Discussion on HN
    7. 7
      Exploiting iOS 11.0-11.3.1 Multi-path-TCP:A walk through
      1 person · 2 points · first shared 2018 · Discussion on HN
    8. 8
      VMware Bugs Leading to Guest to Host VMWare Virtual Machine Escapes
      2 people · 1 points · first shared 2018 · Discussion on HN
    9. 9
      Racing for everyone: descriptor describes TOCTOU in Apple's core
      1 person · 1 points · first shared 2017 · Discussion on HN
    10. 10
      WindowServer The privilege chameleon on macOS Part 1
      1 person · first shared 2024

    What HN people wrote when they linked it

    • badrabbitJun 2023

      It doesn't have to be vt-d:
      https://keenlab.tencent.com/en/2018/04/23/A-bunch-of-Red-Pills-VMware-Escapes/

      I can confidently tell you that your understanding of security mitigations is flawed. And I say that based on experience not just a baseless opinion. Silver bullets in security don't exist.

      Let's every moveit instance was run in a container in a vm and in a dmz (actually moveit transfer is usually deployed in a dmz, isolated from everything else). But the entire purpose of the software is to contain all these important files and expose them to authorized parties, basically a file server (even has sftp!). The threat actors in this case didn't even bother compromising the OS, they just got a session id as a result of abusing sqli and .net deserialization flaw and logged into the webui and downloaded the files. At no point could a vm have stopped any of this.

      I said your undersranding is flawed because you mindset is solution centric not data centric. If all an attacker cares about is access to your gmail, a qubes VM with strict selinux rules is useless if they get you to click on a link that exploits firefox to steal your gmail cookies, defeating any yubikey 2fa you may have.

    • krackersMay 2024

      Yeah on macos the communication between your app and the window server (which is conveniently called WindowServer) happens via mach ports. Most of it is undocumented, in fact anything more "low-level" than using AppKit is undocumented, although IIRC it is in principle possible to use undocumented CG* apis to create and manipulate windows yourself without going through the appkit layers. I think each CG* api is basically a thin shim that communicates to the window server, which has a corresponding CGX* implementation which does the actual logic. This article has some details https://keenlab.tencent.com/en/2016/07/22/WindowServer-The-privilege-chameleon-on-macOS-Part-1/

    • gridlockdMay 2019

      Haven't read what they're doing, but chances are they are using an adversial neural network.

      The job of the adversarial network is to tell apart real from fake. The job of the neural network is to fool the adverserial network. Both are trained in tandem.

      One could imagine training another adverserial network that isn't used to train the network itself, and so will pick up on nuances that the original adversary doesn't pick up on. Anyone could do that, I don't think it's the author's responsibility.

      Somewhat related:

      https://keenlab.tencent.com/en/2019/03/29/Tencent-Keen-Security-Lab-Experimental-Security-Research-of-Tesla-Autopilot/

    • MaimedpuppetApr 2019

      Given recently revealed vulnerabilities to the Tesla autopilot [1],for example, the adversarial markers that can cause the car to change lane, is it responsible for Tesla to go even further toward self driving without some way to mitigate such vulnerabilities first?

      [1] https://keenlab.tencent.com/en/2019/03/29/Tencent-Keen-Security-Lab-Experimental-Security-Research-of-Tesla-Autopilot/

    • aurelwuMar 2019

      you can link to a specific page in pdfs by adding #page=[PageNumber] to it, for example:
      https://keenlab.tencent.com/en/whitepapers/Experimental_Security_Research_of_Tesla_Autopilot.pdf#page=20

      Or did you mean that there is not a specific page in the pdf which gives an overview?

    • tomcooksMar 2019

      Why link to some dude's twitter, I WONDER, when he links the [actual paper](https://keenlab.tencent.com/en/whitepapers/Experimental_Security_Research_of_Tesla_Autopilot.pdf).

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